If I was the emperor of software, every application would be entirely self contained within its own folder – all the program files, settings, configuration stuff, everything it needs to do its thing just in a folder conveniently labelled with the name of the application (then sorted into a few subfolders like program, data, settings and such)

That way it’d be able to run from anywhere you like, be completely portable, no need to even install it – just look in the folder and hit the big shiny shortcut to the main executable.

This might lose out on ease of changing system-wide settings, but if the OS had all the common variables contained in a highly trimmed down form of the Windows registry (preferably including documentation of what an option does within one click of looking at said option) then all the programs could reference that where necessary, or assume sensible defaults if it’s unavailable.

I like portable apps for this reason, and I’m basing the above on how they tend to be packaged, why can’t all applications be like that – what actually purpose does going through the motions of “this is an application I have installed, this is one I have an installer for” serve?

:mentally answers own question:

The compression benefits of installer files could be got by making a super-simple installer that has one button – “unpack the application” then sends you to the main config file when its done in case there’s anything you want to change

With the above addition the need for keeping things separated to prevent conflict between versions, or automatically installed malware is moot as well

The emperor has spoken! :mrgreen: (now someone pick holes in my idea so I won’t feel so hard done by that it doesn’t exist :wink:)

But you have to remember that on a Mac most tasks can be accomplished by some sort of drag-and-drop action. So this is not just a out-of-the-blue design whim. It’s a choice consistent with the overall Apple interface design.

So if our “first time user” spent some time playing around with his Mac, this method may actually be intuitive to him.

I agree with Dax that the uninstall process on Windows is horrendous. However, I don’t think that the Mac process is very intuitive at all.

The very fact that you need a screenshot to demonstrate how to install a program is a clear sign that it’s not clear from the installation process itself.

While the Windows method of installation is not very good in itself, I believe the wizard approach is more intuitive for first time users. Sure.. first time users won’t have a clue whether to install for the ‘current user’ or for all users, or which directory to install to, but these are problems with the windows installer, not the wizard.

If the wizard approach could be streamlined to be a one click process (there are many ‘quick-installs’ now.. like game installer). I think that approach would be usable by all.

The mac approach definately has its ‘wow’ factor. Look at that adium screenshot, wow.. it even has a different icon when the Adium app is grabbed!

I have never used a Mac but am impressed with the ease of uninstalling a program. One of my pet peeves with Windows is that uninstalling a program can become a hassle. Some installers put a link in the shortcuts created on the Start menu. Some put an entry into the Add/Remove programs utility. Some do both. Some don’t do anything and expect the user to forget about the application or manually delete the application’s folder. The Mac way sounds much simpler since the user doesn’t have to hunt for how to remove the application. Click, drag, done.

Kenny, thanks for the screen shot. I really don’t think installation gets any easier than this.

The Mac install process is often made even easier when a link to Applications is put directly in the .dmg. Adium was the first Mac program I ever installed, and it only took a second or two of looking at this screen to figure out how.

Yeah i hear my parents don’t own a computer either. Altho they are under pressure from friends and church and society in general to get one. Not having an e-mail address these days is worse than not having a phone, lol

Are you kidding? Users with no prior computer experience are easy to find. I’m not really looking for people who never used a computer – just for people who don’t own one, and probably wouldn’t be able to tell OSX from Windows.

Hell, I wouldn’t have to look far for these people. Both my mom and my dad, my aunt on my father’s side, and both my grandmothers are in this group. So I already have 5 people in my closest family.

And yeah, apt is fart from perfect, but when it’s working, its just about the best system I have seen.

It seems to me they make much ado about nothing. true both articles make the installation process seem more complex on the mac than on the win machine. Locating a folder surely can’t be a particularly difficult thing to do and if it is consistent across all installs it certainly wouldn’t be a problem. Windows programs lack such consistency some lack even an setup.exe. Even with a setup program some installations ask an end user far too many questions and some do not even install in the program files folder. A few seem to like to install to the C:\ appfoldername…that bugs me for some reason.

I like keeping my program files folder sorta organized and have found some programs have problems if you do not let them install to the default location. Invariably your program folder becomes a mess no what ya do., uninstalls often leave trash there and trash in the registry too. In my experience most windows users do know about the program files folder and have a vague idea at least of what it is for. At least most know enough to stay out of it. haha.

I’m not sure where you would get a group of people with no computer experience. I watched a video of Jane Goodall speaking the other day and she mentioned a tribal shaman using a laptop (windows probably) dressed in full native attire and resisting the westernization of his culture but using the laptop to surf the Internet and learn english. I suppose so he could better understand what he was up against. haha But nonetheless the whole world is becoming acclimated to our gadgets.

I agree the simplicity of apt “beats both systems with respect to consistency and user experience.” People I’ve introduced ubuntu to totally love it and wonder why windows does not support such a system. Of course apt has its flaws mainly not everything is found in the repos, the newest versions of some programs take a long time to get added to the repos beginning users are going to have problems adding other repos and certainly are going to have problems compiling stuff and so on. But apt and deb are a great innovation :)